Talk:Kakine Teitoku/@comment-24007030-20140728023821/@comment-5230978-20140820113118

And you say that because mikoto used it (black ball (DM)) in a attack while DM is a part of accels evolution => black ball cant be made out of DM?

Because of the connection between the powers of Accel and Kakine. A meaningful connection symbolized by them having Dark Matter wings, a characteristic that Mikoto didn't show.

together with what we know: that DM is mostly unknown, it has different looks(versions) and specifications + DM can be used to make explosions (we dont know more but it is still the case) AND that accel used his wings for attacks too (even if it wasnt for explosion-types), i dont think that it excludes the speculation "black ball made out of DM".

Accel used the wings to do physical attack but they are still part of his tansformation like angel wings are part of an angel. That's not only an attack. This is a possible interpretation, but with what we know, lvl6= being close to god (maybe even equal), and, god=over science and magic, i dont think that the connectiom will exist forever, im sure that at some point accel will lose the DM/AIM-bound-properties of his awakening...

Accel is not Level 6 yet. We don't know how strong he became with the white wing (we didn't even know how he was with the black ones), but Aiwass said that BW Accel was weaker than Fuse Kazakiri, who is weaker than Misha, an incomplete Gabriel. I don't know strong his power became with the WW, but he must still be around angel-level as he showed and halo only with that and still collapsed after the clash with the telesma mass. If he was a god-like being it wouldn't have happenesd

but with NT10 i also think that the white wings are only a different DM-versio

Touma, fought both Rensa and Accel with the white wings, but the wings' speed and strenght didn't increase and he was still able to counter them like with the black wings, so I doubt the material changed as it would have caused even changes to "physical level" of the wings.

n :( btw, didnt the text say that the halos are made out of the same material as the wings? or was it the same colour?

Same colour only.

''Exactly, accel used his power (with/without the choker), was it ever mentioned that his ability (vector manipulation) did anything in distance? as far as i remember their was only the inexplicable power..''

The text doesn't say that the boulder was near him and it doesn't say that Accel touched/hit it. It say he directed the vectors of the boulder. I don't know if the roar was used as a channel or not but still that's something Accel can't do with his normal power.

I didnt deny the possibility of her having the(?) inexplicable power too,

You said you coulnd't find other way to explain the spher other than DM and you focused only on that. That's not what I call accepting other possibilities.

but everytime accel used his(?) inexplicable power he lost his mind (Vol.13/15) or was in a state where he had inner peace (Vol.22),

The mental conditions of BW Accel and transformed Mikoto are different. Accel's black awakening appears when he feels stong negative emotion and than he show a savagely violent behaviour and he speak the language of the angel (which is probably what Gensei refers when he say that the personality transform into something of another dimension). Mikoto mind was essentially in a trance induced by the combination of Mental Out, Misaka Network, and something else (probably AIM) and than she was controlled by Mitori making her focus on her darker side, but she doesn't show a behaviour like that of BW as she attack only because she is controlled.

of course, mikotos halo makes it possible that she used a inexplicable power, but i highly doubt that, everytime accel used it, it was truly inexplicable, it never manifested anything,

The novel always refers to it as unexplainbla or inexpilcable. Saying that it wasn't is a really poor argument. And who said powers need to manifest something? Does Hliðskjálf, another unexplainable power, manifest something?

it never had a point where the force began and never had a point where the force ended (but since it is a inexplicable force, anything is possible ^_^ )

You know, it's an unexplaible power. Are you serious?

I never tried to say that lvl5.5 mikoto is a clone of a awakened accel/kakine, i only tried to use the comparison of original and clone as explanation why mikotos powers didnt show the same indicators as accels/kakines (angelic speach, wings (in a somehow literal meaning), etc), she only had parts (like the sisters only have parts of mikotos abilitys, they couldnt be like the "original") °_° :)

If this is what you meant then don't use only the word clone but the entire concept. Also, we don't even know if Mikoto transformation would have ever showed wings.

i thought AIM made DM, what else could do that?

Dark Matter are elementary particles that don't exist in this word and he are just created from nothing by Kakine.

''and wasnt it proven that DM can be affected by a AIM-manipulating esper? Therefore, DM is bound to AIM.''

Dude, you didn't understand Takitsubo's power at all. She is able to distort Personal Realities and take control of an ability through reversing the flow of their AIM dispersion fields. '''She take control of the ability. She does not directly control what the ability creates.''' That's what she subconsciously did in NT6.

Maybe you misunderstood me, i referenced to kakines awakening, i never tried to say that AIM allowed the DM-wings to grow, what i wanted to say was: their is a high chance that kakines awakened wings are also made out of DM+AIM since the material which created the "seraphim"-wings was made out DM (which is bound to AIM (because of NT5/6 ) ^_^

I proved you that you misread NT6.

Another thing. One of the reason you are so convinced that the sphere was made of Dark Matter was that it reminded you Accel balck wings, but if we want to be really objective the sphere presents two light coloured areas similar to eyes of a cyclone, somehting that Accel black wings have not. But more importantly, was it ever explictly stated that the sphere was black? After all Railgun's pages are uncoloured like all mangas, showing only black, white, grey and their hues. For example Mitori hairs appears black like the sphere but they are purple, therefore even they sphere could just be dark coloured and not black.