Talk:Kakine Teitoku/@comment-24007030-20140728023821/@comment-5230978-20140821175301

I never said AIM= DM, i said that DM is bound to AIM, that AIM manipulating espers also manipulated DM, where did i say AIM= DM?

Yes, I know. I just wrote it like that to avoid wasting time.

the PR is like a blueprint of a house while the workers are the AIM particles who turn the idea (ability) into reality >_<

So what? This doesn't explain nothing. And AIM is an energy field not matter.

''So. Your whole reason to think that the black ball wasnt DM is that you say that thanks to the halo mikoto gained a inexplicable power (a different one as accels) and formed with that the black ball? And I should be realistic?''

Poor reading skills or short memory? That's not the sole reason, it's just one of the last reasons I gave you. Reread better and more carefully.

I KNOW that mikoto cant have the same inexplicable power as accel since she was about to reach the lvl where her mind transformed and gaved her access to that power •_•

You are misunderstanding my post for the umpteenth time. I'm not saying that Mikoto's unexplainable power wasn't the same of Accel because her mind didn't reach 53%, but that it was different from Accel's power from the very beginning. Just like Accel, Kakine and Mikoto have different esper powers, so the resulting powers of their awakening must be different,a nd this is preoved that Accel and Kakine doens't have the same awakened power in vol 15. And just to avoid other misreading, when I say they are different I don't mean that each of them follow laws of separate and totally different systems, but that they are different just like esper power aren't all the same.

this is the reason why DM sounds much more logical (and i gaved reasons which you didnt really counter)

I replied to all your speculations, showing you that they can have explanation other than those leading your conclusions and I showed you several differences based on what the novel stated and implied. You, on the other hand, didn't even try to counter some of my arguments, ignoring them, and you focus only on vague similiarites, all explainable in other ways, using speculations over speculations. Said that, I'm not even trying to counter or denying the fact that Mikoto could have used DM as, I already said it a lot of times, I acknowledge that it's a possibility. And I'm not even saying that your theory is totally illogical, but that it's fragile due to its mostly speculative nature. What I'm discussing about is that considering all the actual infos, similiarities and differences included, the possibility that the sphere was made of DM is not the most probable. It's almost like you and me are discussing two different things if you misinterpret and don't understand what I say to you.

instead you started to talk about a second weaker inexplicable force, why making the matters so complicated...

Complicated? When transformed, both Accel, Kakine, and Mikoto showed enhanched esper powers and angel characteristic. Accel showed a power different from esper power (not based on DM), Kakine must have a new power too (not DM and not the same of Accel), then Mikoto can have a different power (of course weaker tha nAccel and Kakine's new powers) too and certainly not a new esper power, which DM is. A more complete explantion about this is given by me in one of the last post of this discussion. You don't seem to have taken it in consideration, so read it. This is not a complicated explanation, but even if it was, "easier" is not synonim of "probable". I hope it's not the case, but if the reason why you support so much DM and ignore/misread my arguments is because you think it would be the easiest answer and not because of objective probability, then we are not even having a proper serious debate and we should just end it.

''Than: incomprehensible forces didnt show this, accels power, ollerus's.... gunhas/kakines powers are inexplicable, they manifested stuff,''

DM is comprehensible. It doesn't follow the law of physics, but AC's scientists still understand what it does and how it works. The very fact that others can give it a clear definition (an elementary particle which is not of this world that can infuse things with 25,000 types of energy etc.) it's a proof that i can be understood at least in part, so it's not even comparable with an incoprehensible power. And even Accel power is not incomprehensible, but just unexplainable as it can still be perceived.

so: mikotos powers never had the caracteristic of accels INCOMPREHENSIBLE power,

I gave you a clear and explicit explanation about that in this post.

''it manifested stuff like gunhas and kakines powers. mikotos powers are as inexplicable as them, ok, so, in the end the black ball is something like gunhas powers? Yes, IF we exclude the fact that mikoto was in a forced awakening (lvl6-shift).''

Sigh. Why you are so unable to understand the meaning of my posts? Gunha's ability was only an example to correct your statements about the inexplicable powers and that they don't manifest anything, nothing more than that. And again Mikoto most likely wouldn't even have been able to achieve that transformation without an external help, so you can't be sure that it was forced (in the sense of twisted or false, if this is what you mean with "forced").

in both cases the first inexplicable power which showed itself was DM

It was never proved. Or are you saying that DM it's the first unexplainable power to appear in the series? If this is what you mean, it's wrong (the first was Accel's power while awakened in vol 13), but even if it was correct it would have meant absolutely nothing.

i never said that mikoto had the same connection as accel and kakine, but she can certainly have DM

And with this you are ignoring the whole explantion I gave you about the connection and the meaning about Accel having DM in his wings. Again.

which is a indicator for "something of a higher plane"

What? DM was only said to be matter that doesn't exist in this world and doesn't follow the laws of physics. No one ever said that it was something of an higher plane. Don't make things up.