Forum:Naming Conventions...

Naming Conventions... Again? And the Need for Policies
So I've noticed that we are still implementing last name-first name order for Japanese names. As far as I remember, they are there way back when I was still a normal user in this wiki. But what I've noticed is that many large wikis are implementing first name-last name ordering, like in Bleach and Naruto wikis. If ever we implement this, a lot of articles would need to be edited for proper ordering, but it will be less confusing for users to determine if Kamijou is Touma's surname, for example.

Also, I've noticed that we haven't come up with a concrete set of rules for this wiki. We are steadily growing with about 500 articles (400-500 excluding redirect pages) and handling such a big number of articles would be chaotic without a set of guidelines. GalaxyTM has pointed out in the main page about segregation of information from the light novels and the anime adaptation, and add the yet-undecided naming conventions and some other stuff here.

I'd like everyone to participate on the discussion so that we can at least let the other users know your ideas and, all in all, to improve on this wiki.

heraldofmeridian♣ 01:46, October 9, 2010 (UTC)

I don't believe there is a reason, but if there is a necessary reason to use first name-last name order, then it probably should be considered. I don't think this wikia needs to follow other wikis... After all, we just do what we feel is better, no?

A set of guidelines is a good idea. We should brainstorm some here. We already have two: the naming order convention, and the segregation of light novel summaries from anime/manga summaries. I put up the latter now because season 2 has started and most of the light novels covering S2 has been translated. We'll have a spike in edits and users, and starting now, it'd be best to keep them separated. An example of having the two separated can be seen here at Kanzaki's article.

GalaxyTM 02:45, October 9, 2010 (UTC)

Still waiting for fellow users to add on the discussion.

heraldofmeridian♣ 07:11, October 11, 2010 (UTC)

Naming conventions shoud stay as is, Japanese style for Japanese names and Western style for western names; characters should be referred by their given names, to remove confusion from other characters with similar names such as Touma and Touya.

For codenames such as the Misakas, we should include their serial number when we refer to them. For nicknames such Aogami Pierce I thinks it should appropriate to use the first name.

For other things such as episode, manga and light novel standards. I'm kind of comfortable on how the episode articles are setup right now. For manga and light novels, I don't really know since I have yet to edit any of those articles, though it would be wise to make them follow a somewhat similar pattern to the episodes.

TheGreatEye 14:16, October 11, 2010 (UTC)

I recently summarized Light Novel 8, and it gets kinda repetitive when I use the same name again and again and again. I kept at it, though, using pronouns and the like. I mainly called them however they were referred to in the Baka-Tsuki translated text. When people are introduced (or the first time they appear in any given wiki article) most people with family names, but Mikoto with her given name (because the other Misakas do appear). When people are not referred to by name but the identity is implied, I wrote what the text said but linked to the person's article. Do tell me if that needs changing.

CarVac 19:46, October 11, 2010 (UTC)

Character Article Policies

It has come to my attention that there are currently no proper guidelines and policies as to how a Character profile article is to created and handled. Originally, articles had little-to-no sections at all, such as the current Biagio Busoni, eventually as more editors came in, it eventually evolved into the structure that what the majority of articles in the wikia has now a shining example is that of the Kamijou Touma article, however, they have many variations as well.

Right now, there is currently a new trend in character article editing, such as the Accelerator article and I believe the time is now for us to reach into an agreement as to what guidelines and policies we should use in regards to character articles.

For me, I believe, we should go about it in this way:

Character name Character name written in their native script/language Relevant information as to introduce the character.

--Character Background Section--

Relevant information regarding the character's background before the events of the series.

--Character Appearance Section--

Relevant information regarding the character's apperance/looks, etc.

--Character Personality Section--

Relevant information regarding the character's apperance/looks, etc.

--Chronology Section-- (there should be an agreement as to whether we should use the term chronology or plot, or whether or not we should have two separate sections for Railgun or Index, even though they naturally move forward in the same timeline)


 * ---Arc Subsection--- (there should be an agreement as to the naming of arcs, as well)


 * Light Novel Version Sub-Sub section (section to be provided if there are two or more vastly differing versions of the same arc, such as the Kanzaki Kaori article)
 * Relevant information regarding the character's involvement in the Light Novel Version of the arc.
 * Anime Version Sub-Sub section (same reason for the Light novel version section)
 * Relevant information regarding the character's involvement in the anime Version of the arc.
 * ---2nd Arc Subsection---
 * Etc.

--Abilities section--

Relevant information regarding the character's abilities

--Other appearances section--

Relevant information regarding the character's other appearances that are authorized, either by the author, studio, publishing company, etc.

---Relevant sub section---(used if the character is in two or more significant appearances, for example a section on video games, or cameo apperances)

Relevant information regarding the character's other apperances

--Character Art Design section--

Section where we introduce notable design changes of the character --Trivia section--

Relevant information regarding the character that has little significance, such as notable quirks, speculations, etc.

--Quotes section--

Notable quotes by the character

--References section--

This is extremely important, we should stop putting information arbitrarily anymore, we should at least provide a decent reference to the information regarding the character.

If one has ideas on what should be done, feel free to share.

TheGreatEye 08:42, October 18, 2010 (UTC)

Everything there looks good to me - no complaints here. Should be enforced.

Other things we should consider are Japanese terms and their translations. I'm mostly referring to the 'nihongo' template here.

Japanese Name/Translation (漢字, Romanization ?, Literal Translation if necessary) - like in Tokiwadai Middle School is what I think is best. Having hiragana, like in Sakugawa Middle School, is superfluous when most readers are English speakers and a romanized reading is already provided.

Kamachi tends to give kanji different readings (usually katakana). How to present these should be looked at. For example Judgment...provides all the information correctly but burns your[my] eyes.

Judgment (風紀委員, Fuuki Iin ?, Disciplinary Committee) - removes the katakana and katakana romanization but looks alot better. Most of the katakana readings can be directly translated into English anyway so nothing is lost.

The Character Info boxes should also be remade. They look great, but only for espers. For Magicians, you end up going 'what's his power level?' For normal folk, the ability section would just be empty which just looks plain bad, and deters people from even adding an info box. eg: Kamijou Touya. I don't know how the infobox works or how to modify it but this is definately something to look into.

Finally. What is everyone's stance on complex codes? I just kind of annoys me being unable to edit in Rich Text.

Fukitscold 11:50, October 18, 2010 (UTC)

I noticed that this talk page is getting cluttered already. XD Should we move this huge discussion elsewhere? I might move this along with your posts (signatures included, don't worry) into a blog post or in the Watercooler.

Oh, and I've read through the proposals and I can't say anything wrong against it. That's good; however, one of our users have been modifying the layout for many character articles, so we would need to revert things or tweak it a bit. By tomorrow GMT+8 I'll be working on the first drafts of the policies, which would be based on Bleach Wiki for the meantime. Since there's no one going against the suggestions posted, I'll have the proposals above on the draft.

As for the Infobox, I'll be working on a new Infobox, created only for this Wiki. I have done the same thing on the Shakugan no Shana Wiki (although it's not really flawless), and you guys can propose on some designs for it.

heraldofmeridian♣ 13:10, October 18, 2010 (UTC)

Well at the rate at he's going we might as well adopt his way doing thigs. Anyway, the users of this wiki should at least come here and discuss what standards that they want to implement, though there's is like only 3-5 active users in the wiki, I think we need to have at least a sign in the frontpage saying that they need to participate in the discussion.

As for the nihongo characters, well I agree with your statement Fukitscold. Katakana use should be lessened as it needlessly bulk-up the articles, especially the article introduction paragraph. As for the complex code editting, I see no problems with it since I have worked with codes alone before.

Eagerly awaiting your edits heraldofmeridian♣.

TheGreatEye 05:36, October 19, 2010 (UTC)

Okay, after experiencing a glitch which caused me to lose my ability to edit articles, I've finished part of the Manual of Style, the main policy to be enforced here. Like I said, it's somewhat similar to the Bleach Wiki, and I'm even having thoughts about contacting them for borrowing some ideas. :P Anyway, the Manual is still not complete, so I still need some of your brain juice to complete it.

As for now, I've fixed the overall layout of this forum page, and I'm hoping that you guys follow suit, just to keep this from being cluttered. Next stop would be a quick tour around newly-edited pages and it will be a good night's rest again.

heraldofmeridian♣ 13:24, October 19, 2010 (UTC)

About the naming convntion for the Arcs tittles, as you can see most of them were done by me so I leave my own idea of them:
 * 1) Index and the Church of the Necessary Evil.
 * 2) Deep Blood Arc<--- This isn't my idea.
 * 3) Sisters Arc<--- This isn't my idea but is fine.
 * 4) Kanzaki Kaori and the Angel Fall Arc<--- I want to change the current name to this since many volumes are related with a character and a certain event/artifact/other character.
 * 5) Three Stories Arc
 * 6) Kazakiri Hyouka and the Imaginary Number Discrict
 * 7) Orsola Aquinas and The Book of Law Arc
 * 8) Musujime Awaki and the Remnants of Tree Diagram Arc
 * 9) Oriana Thomson and the Daihasei Sports Festival Arc
 * 10) Agnese Sanctis and La Regina del Mare Adiatico Arc
 * 11) The Way of the Light and Darkness Arc<--- I called this arc because of at the end Accelerator gets dragged by A.C. Darkness and Touma starts his conflict against G.R.S who are supposed to be the light of the world.
 * 12) Here must be the SS1 a.k.a Volume 13.5
 * 13) Terra of the Left and Document of Constantine Arc
 * 14) Itsuwa and Aqua of the Back's Attack Arc
 * 15) Carrisa and Curtana Original Arc< A better is Carrisa and the War in Britain Arc.
 * 16) Dragon(≠Angel) Arc<I liked the tittle but some times I think I need a better idea
 * 17) Fiamma of the Right and the World War III Arc

I will give more ideas about other stuff later.--Lero 15:35, October 19, 2010 (UTC)

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As far as i know Asians having their family name put first and their first name put last unlike western

also the Arc name idea is very nice

yeah for Carrisa and Curtana Original Arc probably fit the most Carrisa and the War in Britain Arc.

WiliamZ 02:34, October 20, 2010 (UTC)

There is a discussion page for that Lero, go here: link.---TheGreatEye 17:27, October 19, 2010 (UTC)